Though if they do work well they could be used together with a completely separate circuit and control mechanism just to check for the extremes like a tank-overfill.
That is something to keep in mind just use these non contact sensors for upper and lower limits. Bit I am still feeling that one type of device with redundancy would be simplest to develop software for. But at least assuring the upper limit is known beyond doubt is worth considering! As to your clamp thought the best way to figure out is to try.
At the risk of reawakening the severe griping about my hand-drawn figures ... I decided to see if you could cut off the edge of your 4" pipe and make a 30mm flat side without needing to add anything else on top of it.
Turns out you can. If you make the cut 47mm away from the centre of the pipe, you'll get over 30mm wide flat strip.
It is int the quality of the sketch but that it delivers clear information that counts. The information here is clear, thank you.
In the pipe that I played with and cut I mentioned covering the cut edge to smooth things up a bit. but there is another issue, that may or may not be important, The interior of the pipe wall is a different plastic, and if yu look closely at pic you will see that, and I am wondering if the attachment of a flat piece also acts to seal that different plastic from the elements?
Thanks for the clarification, and indeed I am glad to participate as I like to help wherever I can... I've come in late on this project after a long period off, so sorry if I have missed some points... I have tried to speed read as much as I can to get up to date, but I may have missed some points doing so - I hope you understand and can answer me accordingly
Cheers.
Don't ever worry about asking a question that may have already been asked, this is a long thread and even myself and those who follow regularly forget what was said before. My position was and always will be "The only bad question is the one not asked" and "The only bad idea is the one not presented". Thx for all your input!
Thx for the heads up on that ESP32 dependability. From what I think you are saying it seems that it not a hardware issue but a firmware issue where a reboot gets things going again. Correct me if I am wrong?
Thats correct. But of course we do not know about the quality of the code, the libraries used, etc, when we hear that an esp32 has frozen.
I give you a link to a profession view of the esp32 where they seem to be saying great for industrial use, but not with Arduino firmware, and a link to info on using the esp32's internal watchdog, and one to making an external watchdog.
Personally I would use the arduino firmware but include an external watdog to be on the safe side where long absences are going to happen, but I would think of using this approach whichever board or firmware I was using. (and as previously mentioned I usually use the micropython firmware on esp32's)
Thx for the heads up on that ESP32 dependability. From what I think you are saying it seems that it not a hardware issue but a firmware issue where a reboot gets things going again. Correct me if I am wrong?
Thats correct. But of course we do not know about the quality of the code, the libraries used, etc, when we hear that an esp32 has frozen.
I give you a link to a profession view of the esp32 where they seem to be saying great for industrial use, but not with Arduino firmware, and a link to info on using the esp32's internal watchdog, and one to making an external watchdog.
Personally I would use the arduino firmware but include an external watdog to be on the safe side where long absences are going to happen, but I would think of using this approach whichever board or firmware I was using. (and as previously mentioned I usually use the micropython firmware on esp32's)
First thanks for this very valuable information, did not watch entire video but enough to appreciate.
So you know, Back before considering Micro-Processors as a solution to my irrigation system I reviewed what I then considered a hardware solution, was likely embedded MIcro-processor(s), that only stayed on for 4 hours. So you had to figure on making a system that every so often shutdown and restarted. Ha, ha likely their way of watchdog implementation.
Throughout this thread there have been discussions on how our design of measuring water level would hold up under a restart situation. There has been no doubt it is a necessary consideration. This tool that you've just introduced me to might be a way to proactively restart the system when any unit (there will be lots of them) within system is even suspected of problems.
We'll have to keep this in mind as we design, again Thank You!
The project in the link below may be a useful read and the following caught my eye
Quote
The first generation water level sensor used an ultrasonic sensor mounted in the top of the tank. This device was oriented so it pointed straight at the water surface. Ultrasonics measured the time of flight for a pulse to be emitted and bounce off the water surface. The sensor calculated this distance and presented the data on a serial interface.
About two thirds of the measurements received were accurate but the remainder were at one extreme or the other of the sensor range. The actual reason for this condition was difficult to diagnose, but it may have been due to condensation forming water droplets on the face of the transducer.
The tanks are fully enclosed polyethylene enclosures and when sitting in the Australian sun, the humidity level in the air space above the water is very high. This design also placed the electronics and the sensor in the same enclosure. Despite the electronics being somewhat sealed from the sensor, some humidity was detected in the electronics enclosure. This caused minor corrosion after about a year of operation.
That brings up an interesting point, we've talked about the effects of heat and humidity on the sensors but what about the Arduino (or ESP or RP2040 ucontroller).
How and where is the control circuit going to be placed to keep it safe and dry and warm and cool and still keep short wires to the sensors ?
Anything seems possible when you don't know what you're talking about.
That brings up an interesting point, we've talked about the effects of heat and humidity on the sensors but what about the Arduino (or ESP or RP2040 ucontroller).
How and where is the control circuit going to be placed to keep it safe and dry and warm and cool and still keep short wires to the sensors ?
Following is pic of Waterproof JSN-SR04T Ultrasonic Sensor I tested.
Excellent ! I'm curious to see how it performed vs the waterlogged one.
As a reminder to those NOT expected in any way shape or form to remember ALL these details and things and posts and whatever of this now 21 page thread, on 2021-10-15 4:32 am I posted:
News on JSN-SR04T Waterproof Ultrasonic Distance Sensor
It arrived and as you can see from pic has ALL necessary paraphernalia.
Initial tests demonstrate fairly well that IT WORKS in the 4" PVC I used for previous tests. A quick overview of results:
I copied the code Bill used in his video on waterproof sensors and supplemented output of mm with cm and in.
All tests were handheld.
I don't have saved data and accurate comparison charts was/am anxious to share what I know so far since there is so much so favorable.
I used both the 72" 182cm and 48" 122cm 4" PVC. Measurements inside and outside 4" PVC appeared the same. Inside was more consistent I believe because outside picked up misc stuff in studio when I wiggled a bit. The 4" PVC seemed to kept things more consistent.
All tests were short of actual measurement, 72" 182cm around 1.75" 4.5cm and 19" 48cm around 1" 2.5CM. For sure a better controlled testing environment will have more meaningful numbers.
No valid measurements under 9" 23cm and this is expected behavior for this sensor.
Thinking I would rather not have to install sensor 9" 23cm above a full tank and so ordered from DFROBOT the A02YYUW and it appears to have all the necessary paraphernalia.
In the post just repeated above I said:
"Thinking I would rather not have to install sensor 9" 23cm above a full tank and so ordered from DFROBOT the A02YYUW and it appears to have all the necessary paraphernalia."
In light of Byron's last post in this thread at 2021-10-17 5:40 pm pointing out that about 1/3 of ultrasound measurements were inaccurate and they summarized "... it may have been due to condensation forming water droplets on the face of the transducer" . I am thinking that distance between transducer and water might be a good thing and I am NOW working on a design that would allow for both space and a fan. Will be posting that in a bit! I do think that either JSN-SR04T or A02YYUW would work in my current design and one might be more accurate/dependable than the other.
Is the above enough to give you an idea how the waterproof version works?
I was hoping that you'd post the actual and measured distance table similar to the one you did before. I was going to do a least squares line on it too and compare the accuracy and linearity. But, I know you have a lot on your plate right now (and for most of the winter) so just carry on 🙂
As far as the fan in the pipe goes, wouldn't it be enough to just drill holes in the pipe and let the vapour escape by itself ?
Anything seems possible when you don't know what you're talking about.
I was hoping that you'd post the actual and measured distance table similar to the one you did before. I was going to do a least squares line on it too and compare the accuracy and linearity. But, I know you have a lot on your plate right now (and for most of the winter) so just carry on
I will get around to that, for sure, and for sure will share!
As far as the fan in the pipe goes, wouldn't it be enough to just drill holes in the pipe and let the vapour escape by itself ?
Lot of moisture in that pipe! And for sure installing a fan is not a trivial task.
The project in the link below may be a useful read and the following caught my eye
Quote
The first generation water level sensor used an ultrasonic sensor mounted in the top of the tank. This device was oriented so it pointed straight at the water surface. Ultrasonics measured the time of flight for a pulse to be emitted and bounce off the water surface. The sensor calculated this distance and presented the data on a serial interface.
About two thirds of the measurements received were accurate but the remainder were at one extreme or the other of the sensor range. The actual reason for this condition was difficult to diagnose, but it may have been due to condensation forming water droplets on the face of the transducer.
The tanks are fully enclosed polyethylene enclosures and when sitting in the Australian sun, the humidity level in the air space above the water is very high. This design also placed the electronics and the sensor in the same enclosure. Despite the electronics being somewhat sealed from the sensor, some humidity was detected in the electronics enclosure. This caused minor corrosion after about a year of operation.
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